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Saturday, November 7, 2009
Army list tinkering
I was doing some thinking about Pre-Heresy armies and I came to the conclusion that they look really nice, but they are very boring on the table top.
Take everything that is at least a little interesting in the Space Marine codex and Chaos Codex and throw them out, and what you have left is a Pre-Heresy army.
You do have a great looking army thought because you have Jetbikes instead of bikes, turbo-fan back packs instead of the regular assault marines, and the unique look of the earlier space marine armors.
But underneath the look you have a very basic army.
I have changed around some things so here is the army so far:
Ahriman
Dreadnought
10 Chaos Space Marines
10 Chaos Space Marines
Rhino
9 Thousand Sons
5 Oblits
Land Raider
I traded the havocs for a land raider. I did this for a few reasons. Some armies just do not have an answer for Land Raiders. Also it is mobile and can move troops around while Havocs have a little better firepower, but they are very static. The good news is that it means that I have to do 10 less marines, and will have an interesting model to work on. Sure makes the army rather small though which is both good and bad. If I was not so interested in the look of the army and wanted to go for more power I would drop Ahriman and the dreadnought and up the firepower and maybe some terminators for counter assault.
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Awful small count but as you stated, you're going for theme which I respect. I think there is a big modeling opportunity in Heresy TS Terminators though;
ReplyDeletehttp://wh40k.lexicanum.com/mediawiki/images/7/73/Preheresy-TS.JPG
Plus it will give you a bit of counter-punch.
Yeah, I think I will take a unit of them because I need some counter-assault. Right now if any assault unit/army gets into hand-to-hand with me, I will have trouble winning that fight. Chaos in general are pretty good in assault, but they will lose to any h-t-h specialists.
ReplyDeleteTerminators are a good unit, but boy am I hurting for points.
I would have to drop an oblit, and maybe a TS marine, but other than that, there are no points to be had.
Another list option:
ReplyDeleteHQ
Ahriman
Elite
3 Terminators w/Reaper Auto Cannon, Chain Fist
Aspiring Champion w/2 Lightning Claws
Troops
9 Chaos Space Marines w/Lascannon, Plasma Gun
Aspiring Champion w/Powerfist
Rhino
9 Chaos Space Marines w/Lascannon, Plasma Gun
Aspiring Champion w/Power Weapon
5 Thousand Sons Marines
Aspiring Sorcerer w/Bolt of Change
Heavy Support
Land Raider
Predator w/Hull Heavy Bolters
3 Obliterators.
I do not know if I am happy with this army’s firepower.
While I understand that you are unhappy with the second armies firepower, I personally like the second list better.
ReplyDeleteI am not a big fan of Chaos Dreadnoughts - unless they have to close combat weapons. In which case, they are very strong against Carnifexes, and large blocks of strength 5 critters.
While I do not have your vast tournament experience, I worry about having only 2 transports - especially with the increase in missions that have objectives at the corners of the table.
That being said, I do like the firepower of the second list, as it has a good mixture of anti-horde and anti-tank.
Opps!
ReplyDeleteI forgot the Dreadnought, he is still there (I can’t drop big red!). He is a bit of a concern now because I have a lot of vehicles now, and if he goes crazy, it will be a pain to stop him from doing some damage. I should do what everyone else does and give him 2 CCW, but I need the shooting. Maybe I will give him and auto cannon or a plasma cannon and place him next to the land raider where he can't hurt anybody.
The army is now getting kind of Mech feel, and I wanted to stay away from that.
Also the troops are getting a little uncomfortably low.
How I build an army is I go down a list of all of the top builds of armies and I compare my army to these hypothetical armies, and see if I have an answer for what they are going to bring.
When I did that army comparison I was worried about Mech armies. I took off things like Havocs and Oblits, and I replaced them not only with vehicles that can be stunned or killed with one shot, but I am replacing their long range, high strength shooting with a couple of auto-cannons on the predator and the terminators. A questionable trade off, although I did increase the counter-assault by adding the terminators.
The loss of the Havocs and the Oblits is probably going to hurt you against Heavy Mech armies. I actually like the fact that you tend to take heavy infantry armies.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I think you need a bit of mech - transports, to counter some of the newer missions where they place the objectives in the four corners of the game board.
If points were not so tight, I would say that the predator could/should be changed out for a Havoc squad....I just have no idea where you would get the points.
I added the predator because they are so cheap (100 points) so I really can't get anything gooed unless I remove something else.
ReplyDeleteI know what you are thinking, and no, the Dreadnought stays!
The loss of the Oblits is what really hurts. They are tough to take out, and with a weapon for every situation, they are a great unit.
I will playtest it a lot in the coming months to see what I can and can't live without.
LOL....it is your list....and you have the experience.
ReplyDeleteI play bugs and eldar, so I have no experience with Chaos Dreadnoughts except as an opponent...and they seem to be a 50/50 shot as to whether or not they work. n
I do understand their value, especially against Crushers, Spawn...etc. I just am not a fan of things that I have limited control over.
I am interested in seeing the finished product.
What about dropping that Predator and beefing those Thousand Sons up. 5 doesn't like much firepower and allocation may nab that DoomBolt rather quickly.
ReplyDeleteYou could also load up on combi-meltas on the Terms, drop the Reaper...then either DS to take out quick mech/LR or mount up in the LR...
If you have time, I wouldn't mind some feedback on a list I'm throwing together as well. It's my first year playing the 40k Championship so would appreciate any feedback someone experience might have :). Liking your list though, looking forward to the conversions!
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